Beyond just the RV space, Grounded aims to position themselves as leaders in the modern electric outdoor gear market, tune in to hear what's coming next!
Check out the full episode blog post here: https://www.thewaywardhome.com/episode61/
Connect with Kristin Hanes and The Wayward Home!
Beyond just the RV space, Grounded aims to position themselves as leaders in the modern electric outdoor gear market, tune in to hear what's coming next!
Check out the full episode blog post here: https://www.thewaywardhome.com/episode61/
Connect with Kristin Hanes and The Wayward Home!
One major bummer about van life is just how expensive it is to purchase fuel. Our Sprinter Van costs anywhere between $80 and $100 to fill up, depending on fuel prices, and we have to fill it up at least once per week, or more depending on just how much we're driving. Well, imagine a camper van world where you never had to fill up. And yeah, that world might soon become a reality, especially as electric RVs start to grace the market. Today we're talking to one of those electric camper van companies called Grounded, and the CEO is here to tell us all about these rigs, their components and when they're expected to hit the market. Let's go.
Speaker 1:Welcome to the Wayward Home podcast all about van life, boat life and nomadic living. We'll bring you tips, interviews and stories from the road and on the water. Now here's your host, Kristen Haynes. Hey there, I'm Kristen Haynes with thewaywardhomecom and I spend half the year in my camper van and half on my sailboat in Mexico. I hope to inspire you to live nomatically too. So electric RVs and camper vans have been the talk of the town lately, with several companies coming up with models and prototypes of new electric, and one of those is the company called Grounded, based in Detroit making some really cool camper vans and RVs, and I'm super happy to bring on the CEO of that company, Sam Shapiro, onto the Wayward Home podcast. Sam, I'm really excited that you are joining me today.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thanks, Kristen. Happy to be here.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So first of all, I want to know how you got the idea of even building these types of camper vans. I understand you used to travel in a van as well.
Speaker 2:I did, yeah, during COVID, you know. So I used to live in New York City and I was working there and advertising. Covid happened and I built a camper van and I traveled around the country in the van and worked remotely from the van full time. So I spent about six months doing that. I found a used Chevy Express cargo van low roof. It was about 20 years old and I sort of bought it. It was an old work truck for AT&T and I spent a month or two designing it and then about a month building it out before heading off on the trip.
Speaker 1:Very cool. And what about? That trip sparked your idea that you wanted an electric version of a camper van.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So there's sort of a couple of things. One has to do obviously with the combustion engine in terms of driving and kind of the vehicle side, and then the other part is the interior. So on the vehicle side you know just sort of a lot of the pains that come with combustion engine vehicles. So maintenance, oil changes, paying for gas when you're doing that amount of traveling, as I'm sure you know from your van, it can definitely add up, especially when you're traveling in a gas powered van like that, which don't especially mine it didn't get great mileage or anything and so you're kind of polluting and there's this dichotomy of wanting to spend more time in nature and embrace nature and then at the same time you're kind of burning fumes into the atmosphere. So there's all that stuff and then at one point the vehicle just broke down entirely with engine failure. So that was a big one too.
Speaker 2:So because of all of that the whole time I kept thinking you know, man, if this was electric, it seems like all of these problems, or most of these problems, just completely go away. You know there's really no maintenance. The risk of you know like the sort of motors failing or something is a lot less than you know some one of the thousands of moving parts in a combustion engine vehicle breaking down on you Obviously no pollution, and so that's a lot of what I was thinking about. And then, on the interior part, you know also, as I'm sure you know, you experience this idea of being power budgeted and having to really think about you know what's my battery capacity of the house battery that's inside the RV. How much solar am I going to get today? You know, what appliances do I need to run? You know, like, how long do I need to run the hot water? For how long do I need to run heating and HVAC?
Speaker 2:And in my experience in my camper van and talking to other people in RVs and vans, that's something that you're always kind of thinking about and aware of and almost planning and budgeting around, unless, of course, you have, you know, maybe like a generator on board. You know, but then it sort of circles back to bucket number one problems that I was talking about. And so the cool thing about having an electric vehicle, RV, is that now you have this giant, giant battery and the you know the battery that's powering the vehicle that you can pull from, and so all of a sudden. It kind of just changes the paradigm a little bit of the types of appliances you can run and how long you can run them for.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's all super interesting. And so you've got. You've got this idea. And then how did you bring it from this idea to a reality? Pride to you know. Get a team together and start working on some prototypes. Describe how you got to where you are now in terms of you know everything that had to go into place. I understand, I read somewhere that at first you were working out of a tent. Is that right?
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, we. So I'm originally from Atlanta. It's actually where I kind of left New York to go back to and build my first camper van out of, and you know we were sort of yeah. So I guess I guess kind of the beginning is that I ended up after that whole van experience. I ended up going to work for SpaceX, for Starlink, for a bit as an embedded software engineer, and actually the way that I got there was also related to my van experience because, you know, this was 2020. So Starlink was sort of just rolling out when I was building my van and I wanted one so badly but it was sort of impossible for me to get at that point in time.
Speaker 2:But because of the camper van and the obvious need there for internet, you know, no matter where you're going. That's that's where I really started like closely following Starlink and what SpaceX was doing and that's actually like what led me to going to work there. And so I did that for a bit and then kind of kept thinking about this whole RV space and electric, electric of the RV space. So ended up leaving and spent a little bit of time sort of thinking about this more and talking to people, doing some research, putting together some ideas and ultimately found a co-founder and we, you know, sort of got to the point. We did it sort of as much as we could have, just kind of initial planning on paper, and then got to the point of like, okay, we need to, we need to start building a prototype, and we were looking at some different cities to go to. We ended up coming to Detroit, which I've never lived in and I actually had never been to before at that point, and Detroit is great for a lot of reasons to build this company. I think One is that the whole automotive space is here and so there's a lot of like manufacturing capability here, shop and prototyping capability, built out supply chain machines. You know all of that infrastructure is here in the city or in sort of the metro area. Similarly, there's a lot of automotive engineers and manufacturing engineers here as well, that you know. The idea is we can tap into that network of people and experts. Another cool thing about Detroit is we're only a three hour drive from Elkhart, where you know, 80, 85% of the RVs in America are made, and so MAJOR manufacturers and engineers and suppliers and just the general RV supply chain is all sort of close. And so you know, in some ways I like to say that we're kind of like just close enough, like we don't necessarily want to be in Elkhart, like right there where all the other RVs are made, because we want to do things differently. But we're also not, you know, all the way on the West Coast, where I think it would be really disconnected, you know, from that ecosystem.
Speaker 2:And then the third reason that we're in Detroit is because there's an organization called Michigan Central and they partnered with another organization called New Lab and basically they've built this giant sort of collaborative co-working manufacturing space for startups in the mobility sector right here in Corktown, which is basically next to downtown Detroit and so, you know, we've been able to kind of build the company here in this building, that's, you know, a quarter of a million square feet. We share it with other startups who are also manufacturing kind of electrification of mobility, so like there's an electric ATV startup here, there's an electric bicycle startup here, those types of things, and we get access to equipment, we get access to. You know, we've sort of met like mentors and investors and those sorts of things here and then, of course, like you know, engineers, shop technicians, stuff like that. So it's been a great place to build the company and to build the product. We're very glad we came to Detroit. I love Detroit now, I'm a huge fan and so, yeah, so we came here, we started building and basically since then, over the last little more than a year now, we've built a few of sort of our MVPs, which were called the G1 and they were electric camper vans built on the Ford E-transit.
Speaker 2:Obviously, the big problem with those was the range. The range was super limited. It was barely over 100 miles. Granted, I do think there's a real use case for those If you are not going far, if you are, you know, living on, if you have a big piece of land or you're a resort or something like that, where you want sort of housing that's easy to stand up and move around, like one big piece of land, or maybe you have two properties and they're 30 miles from each other. Like, I think there are use cases, but the use cases are obviously more limited than people who might really want a lot more flexibility in being able to get up and go, you know, further distances.
Speaker 2:And so that was the G1.
Speaker 2:And we did build a few of those.
Speaker 2:But now we have since launched the G2, and the G2 is a 250 mile range electric camper van built on the Brake Drop chassis, and we just launched that last month, in October of 2023.
Speaker 2:And we, as part of the launch of that, we did a 1500 mile road trip in the first G2 around the state of Michigan. So we left Detroit, we went all the way up to the upper peninsula, across the Mackinac Bridge and all the way up to Pictured Rocks, lakeshore, marquette, big Bay and then kind of came back down around the Mitten, around the west side of the state, all the way down through Grand Haven and then eventually back over to Detroit. And that was like a really really amazing trip and kind of like proof point, you know, to ourselves and to others, of like, hey, this is feasible, like you can actually really go far distances for a long period of time, you know, in this new fully electric camper, van yeah that's super cool, because I think that was a lot of people's issues with buying electric vehicles, especially the larger one, is the range was so limited.
Speaker 1:So now that you've come out with the 250 mile one, have you noticed that interest has peaked? Are you getting more orders? What is the response been to that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the reception's been great and I think I think when we launched the G1, the reception was basically you know, because, by the way, like there's some other interesting things that I should definitely mention just about the products, like the modular interior system that we have that allows people to customize the interior, kind of like Lego blocks, that you choose where pieces go and which pieces you want. And then we have a kind of a smart app, sort of like the Tesla app, but for RVs, so you can monitor your battery, solar, which appliances are on, turn them on and off, and you can do that from your phone remotely too. So even if you're not near the vehicle, and we integrate with the underlying vehicle too. So we bring in the actual vehicle EV battery into the app and stuff like in vehicle diagnostics. Actually, we're working on right now integrating to. So there's cool stuff, even about the G1, and the reception was basically, I think, from a lot of people it was like oh, this is great, we love that there's a startup working on this, it looks beautiful, it has all these cool features, but there's this range issue and they need to address that, and so that's what we did with the G2. And also, as you can imagine, made some improvements on the whole interior too. So we decided to actually expose the modular mounting system in the G2 and have a bit more of a Spartan look that we still think looks really clean and beautiful. But by exposing the rails it allows customers to have the opportunity to just mount stuff themselves like other accessories, and also change out modules themselves.
Speaker 2:So with the G1, it wasn't really the type of thing where, as a customer, you weren't really expected to change the layout over time. But with the G2, you actually can. You could say, hey, I'm going on a different trip and I want to switch this whatever bench module with a twin bed module to bring it. Maybe your life changes, you have another kid, whatever it is. So that was one of the other big changes with the G2. But yeah, but in general the reception's been great and a lot of people have put down pre-orders and reached out to us with questions and stuff like that. So we're kind of starting. We'll ramp up basically over the next few months and the next year, but we are already shipping G2s to customers.
Speaker 1:Very cool. Yeah, I was looking at your website and some of these modular interior components and so when someone's in the ordering process, can they just go on and decide the layout, or how does that work and what types of modules can someone put in one of these?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so in the future we will have a self-service online tool where it will be kind of like a 3D drag and drop tool to customize your layout. Right now we have not deployed that self-service tool, so the process is a little bit more manual with our designers right now. So essentially we'll get in contact with you and then kind of show you some of the different options, talk to you, learn about your use case, how you want to use the vehicle, what you need, and then basically send you a 3D render of what we're proposing for the layout and make sure you're good with that. But that's basically what the process is now. But we do eventually want to have the self-service tool just to kind of streamline the whole thing, and then people can kind of just see a lot faster like oh, here's how this would look. Here's how this would look In terms of types of modules.
Speaker 2:It's something that will expand over time, like the catalog of available modules, but right now it's pretty simple. It's like benches and kitchen and closet. We have like an actual full height closet that you can hang clothes in and stuff. An indoor shower is a big one that we get asked a lot about. Wet bath has a shower and a toilet inside. Obviously the queen size bed, which is kind of the default bed that we put in the back. We will offer in the future smaller beds like the twin size bed that I mentioned, and also rear seats with seatbelts, and overhead cabinets or overhead storage units are sort of the other thing, and those go obviously above, so you can mix and match those things.
Speaker 2:But the cool thing is that even with a fairly limited set of modules, there's a lot of possibilities in terms of layout, so you can choose where things go, and then things come in different sizes too. So we're doing like a grid system, so everything is a standard unit size, and so you could think of the floor as being, I think it's 8 by 2, basically, or 8 by 3 if you count the aisle in the middle. And so in the G2 that you'll see photos of on our website, the kitchen is three units wide, which is pretty big. I mean, it's a really, really big countertop space, and then next to it is a two unit wide bench. But somebody might be like, oh, I don't cook that much or I don't need that much countertop space, so I want a. We offer a two unit wide kitchen, and so you could choose that instead and you could put it in the same place and then you could have three unit wide bench or you could put something else in that one extra unit. So that's kind of the idea there.
Speaker 1:And so can someone put other components in there from other companies, like an L-Track system, or is it just proprietary to your modules?
Speaker 2:So the L-Track system would be a little bit different, because that's kind of like putting in the whole new system. But what you can definitely do is just mount your own accessories to our system. So, yeah, you could totally do that. It's kind of a standard aluminum extrusion that we use right now and so, yeah, if you wanted to, you could leave a slot somewhere and then you could put something there.
Speaker 2:Or if you look at the photos, you'll see that there's basically these rails that go sort of like laterally across the length of the van and there's I think there's four of them from the bottom to the top. And so obviously, the kitchen, which comes up pretty high, that has two mounting points in terms of that vertical axis. That has one at the sort of bottom rail and then one at the second rail up, but then there's still two more rails above that right. So, like, the overhead cabinets obviously will be on the top rails, but even like above the bed, if you want to put a reading light, you know that can mount into the track. So, yeah, I think there's a lot of customization opportunities and that's obviously something that's super important to people. It's something that I mean there's things like your house on wheels, and so people want customization, they want flexibility. You know stuff like that. That's what I wanted when I built mine. That's obviously what you wanted when you built yours.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure Cool. And how does it compare to size wise, to like a Mercedes Sprinter or a Ford Transit? What's that comparison like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, first off, we actually offer the G2 in two different sizes, and that's based on the fact that the Braedrop underlying platform comes in two different sizes, which is the Zivo 600 and the Zivo 400. And basically the only real difference between these two things is the length, and so what we sort of launched with, you know, like, if you see the photos on our website or like read some of the articles, everything you'll see is the longer version, which is the 600, and it's about 24 feet long exterior length, and a lot of people have pointed out that that is like pretty long for a class B camper van, and so I think that the shorter one with the Zivo 400, which is about 20 feet long, you know that that might be a much better fit for someone who's looking for something a little bit smaller, a little bit more maneuverable, a little bit more accessible to park in like a regular parking lot type of thing. So we do offer both of those sizes. I think in both cases, for both vehicles, the interior is a lot more spacious than what you would get with like a Transit Van and a converted Transit Van, and the reason is because, basically, the vehicle is a lot boxier.
Speaker 2:So like the Transit Vans or the Sprinter Vans, you know the walls kind of these like metal walls kind of cave in at the top, like they're not, they're not straight, they're not boxy and they also have, you know, quite a bit of thickness to them, because you know they leave sort of that, like there's the, there's that exterior layer of metal and then there's usually like another inner layer and that that inner layer will have like pre-drilled mounting holes and stuff like that and then the whole, and then all of that's like caving in, and so you really like lose a lot of space through all of that. And of course, like all of these vans are designed like across the board, whether it's Ford or Mercedes or now Bright Drop, like all of these vans are really designed for, you know, commercial purposes, not necessarily for like living in them. And so you know, I think that's why, like the engineers at these OEMs are fine with that trade off and that loss of interior space, because in most of the use cases it doesn't actually matter that much. But what's really nice about the Bright Drop is, I mean it's it is perfectly rectangular and the and the whole exterior wall is kind of a very thin, almost like type of plastic and there's obviously, like some, some aluminum structure to it, like some ribs on it, but that's not nearly as thick as, or the sort of like interior gap there of those metal ribs is not nearly as deep as you know, what you'd find in kind of like the ribs of a Ford Transit Van on the walls.
Speaker 2:And so basically, for all of those reasons, like the shape and the thickness you have, you have a ton more room and we have a ton more room that we can work with, and so what we do is ground. It actually builds basically like a whole substructure out of aluminum. So we basically build like a whole box out of aluminum and then that whole box gets mounted inside the Bright Drop Van and then you know, to the hard mounting points that are provided by Bright Drop, and then we obviously add all of our wall panels, we add insulation in between our wall panels and the exterior walls, but what you end up with is like basically something that that doesn't like cave in on you, in the same way that most of these other van conversions are like. Even even the ones coming out of Elkhart from some of the bigger companies have to because of the chassis that they're starting with.
Speaker 1:Totally. I did notice that, when looking at the photos of your van too, that it was more, you know, boxy and probably more spacious toward the ceiling. So that was an interesting concept. And I was wondering can you tell me a little more about the power system?
Speaker 2:you mentioned earlier that it has a pretty beefy system in it, so if you could talk about that a little, yeah, so the battery in the Bright Drop, like the high voltage vehicle battery, is 173 kilowatt hours and, for context, I think the battery in most Teslas is around 70 kilowatt hours. So it's like you know, something like two and a half times as big as a Tesla battery. It's a. It's a giant, giant battery and that's part of why it's so expensive to you know the underlying vehicle platform and so it has this really big battery and of course that's that's like why it can go so far. And then we ground. It also adds an additional house battery. The house battery that we add by default is 10, another 10 kilowatt hours. We can do bigger ones if somebody wants a bigger one. 10 kilowatt hour house battery is already like a much bigger house battery than what you'd find in most van conversions.
Speaker 2:And then our house battery can charge. You know, basically in three ways that can either charge. It will charge from the bright drop battery. So every time that you drive, that you turn the bright drop, that you turn the vehicle on so sort of analogous to how people will wire up house batteries to the alternator of an ice vehicle so every time that you turn the vehicle on, it's charging. So same thing here Every time you turn the vehicle on, the house battery is charging from the high voltage vehicle battery. Obviously it also charges from solar panels on the roof, and then you can also charge it from shore power if you want to just plug it in directly. And then we have a three kilowatt inverter, which is also something we can. We can upgrade if a customer wants, but three kilowatts is enough for 90% of people's use cases. I would say that's about like two space heaters at the same time, or you know, a hot water heater and the induction stove on at the same time. So that's, that's kind of the battery situation.
Speaker 1:Yeah, very cool. It sounds like people can run more appliances and you know, when they're off a grid then they typically would. With a lot of the van conversions we're seeing on the market, yep, yeah definitely. And it can probably power. What are some of the options people are getting, like air conditioners, or what are people using all this power for?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we put an electric HVAC system, so we put a heat pump in electric heat pump and they can do hot and cold and so that's kind of the other big power draw.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so how long do you think this thing could just go boondocking or stay off a grid? What would be your idea about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know people love people, love. People love to ask that question. I mean it's a great question, of course, like anyone who's done this before know, as I know you do. Like it just depends so much on where you are in the country, what the climate situation is, what the solar situation is, what you're running, you know all those sorts of things. So I think, depending on the use case, it could. There's a huge, huge amount of variance. So I always think it's a little bit funny when, when RV makers like quote some amount of time because I'm like, well, what, what, what assumptions were made for that amount of time, what you know what appliances are running and stuff like that. But I think you know definitely several days at minimum and I think you know, depending on use case, that could be stretched pretty substantially.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, depending on what people are using out of all the components they have in their van. They could definitely cut it back by using a propane stove outside, which we do that sometimes. So there are ways to make things last off grid. But it's cool. It can go off for a while. You know, that's fantastic. So many people are like like loving to do that instead of having to be plugged in. So that's great.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so well and then the other thing I should mention is you know, with our app you know we can monitor and track your usage patterns, and so you know you that that hopefully helps because you could. You could sort of see like, okay, you know, I'm spending this much amount of energy, you know, by running these things. And in the future, you know we're going to keep deploying over the air software updates over time, and so we want to add more features to this app in the future that that do smarter and smarter things, like even automating some of this. So you could imagine the app is sort of smart enough to be like, you know, hey, he's, you know this this person's been, you know, this is kind of a silly example but like this person's, you know, had the water heater on for for so long that they probably are done with their shower and, like, forgot to turn the water heater off, so we're just going to turn it off automatically. You know that sort of thing where or maybe we don't do it automatically.
Speaker 2:You know, maybe there's a setting in the app whether you want to let it actually make decisions for you or not, but at the very least something that pops up and says, hey, you know you've been running this thing for a while. Are you sure you want to keep this thing on and kind of like make suggestions and make predictions with things like like hey, you know, we can see that where you are tomorrow is going to generate this amount of solar wattage, you know. So maybe you want to think about doing XYZ or turning XYZ off, you know, or only running it. You know, normally you take a shower for this long, but you should think about taking a shower that's two minutes shorter tomorrow. You know, to save the energy from the water heater because there's going to be an overcast day. You know that that type of intelligence we want to build and we'll continue to kind of update and deploy over time.
Speaker 1:Cool Sounds really interesting and I'm also curious, like with the amount of charging stations across the country. Does it seem like there's enough out there for someone to buy one and do like cross country road trips, or how is that currently looking?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a great question. I mean, I think it's definitely possible. That's probably our next kind of marketing like fun marketing thing is getting someone to drive one of these across the country. I think that infrastructure is probably the single biggest definitely, I would say, the single biggest barrier to higher EV adoption right now, and because I, like, truly, truly believe that that EVs are basically better in every single way other than this issue around charging, and so we need to improve the charging infrastructure.
Speaker 2:It's a horrible feeling if you like show up to an EV charger expecting to charge your vehicle and it doesn't work because it's down, and that's way too common right now. There's apps that help with that, a lot like plug share, where you can see, like, oh, someone was here earlier today and they said that it worked, so I feel pretty dang confident it's going to work when I get there. That helps a lot. Before I started using plug share, my success rate with EV chargers was pretty bad, and then I started using it and now I basically don't have issues. But, like, we need to deploy more chargers and we need to improve the reliability of the ones that that are out there now. The good news is that there is so much happening behind the scenes or sort of like. If you think about it as like an iceberg, like what I think, like what people know about or like read about in kind of like the tier one press right now is really just the tip of the iceberg, like in the kind of the tech world and automotive world which we're pretty immersed in here in Detroit. We can just see how much activity and how much money is going into improving the EV charging infrastructure all around the country. And obviously with the IRA you know that was passed somewhat recently there's also like billions and billions of dollars that are going into improving the charging infrastructure and I think we're going to continue to see picture of the charging infrastructure improve. And then, of course, tesla now has signed agreements with every major OEM, including GM, who owns Sprite Drop, to allow Tesla chargers to charge other OEM vehicles in the future, and that's even going to be.
Speaker 2:You know, there's this little bit of a tangent, but there's two for your, for your viewers who don't know there's basically two EV charging standards. There's Tesla and there's everything else. Tesla is called NACS, the other one is CCS and these are actually like different hardware, right, like the physical connector is different and, of course, like the accompanying software, is also different the way that the vehicle communicates with the charger, and so you know, 99% of the Tesla chargers in America of these, like public public chargers obviously have the only the Tesla NACS standard. But the good news is that Tesla is deploying adapters to their chargers, physical adapters, so that in the future, potentially as early as next year, gm announced you will be able to charge GM CCS vehicles at a Tesla charger with an adapter that Tesla provides to connect your vehicle.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's cool. So there's probably way more Tesla adapters out there than the other type, right? Just because they've dominated the market so far.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, the unfortunate reality for these other OEMs has been that Tesla charging infrastructure is 10 times at least 10 times better and more reliable than sort of all of these other third-party CCS charger companies out there, and so, you know, that's why the OEMs basically made the decision. I mean it's like a little bit funny because for the last 20 years, these other OEMs have been sort of like, you know, a bit patronizing toward Tesla and skeptical of Tesla's future chances of success and things like that. And now they've all kind of, you know sort of, in signing this agreement with Tesla to have their customers charge their vehicles at Tesla chargers and pay Tesla money for electricity. They're sort of implicitly saying you know what, you did the best job out there at setting up this infrastructure. So, yeah, I think I think ultimately it's a great thing for consumers and for for, like, the whole EV picture in America basically.
Speaker 1:Totally, and how long does it take to charge the van once you get to one of the chargers?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the G2, you can do 20% to 80% in about an hour and a half and a full charge is a little bit closer to three hours if you, if you want to go like zero to 100%, and this is at a fast charger.
Speaker 1:Totally Cool. So what are your like? Plans moving forward and expectations for 2023? I'll probably be a big year for you, because you're starting to ship the G2s outright.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think 2023 is kind of like the launch year, like we put this thing out there and and people are sort of learning about us and you know we'll get sort of like our initial initial early adopters. And then 2024 is going to be a little bit more about scaling up and and trying to build a lot more of these and get them in a lot more people's hands. And then the other thing that we have plans for 2024 is we will launch a towable trailer product as well, and so it the idea is that Grounded wants to be a kind of modern electric outdoor recreation company, and so you know, we're not saying like we're, we're not a camper van company, we're not an RV company, but obviously RVs, towables and motor homes are sort of at the. In a way, they're kind of like the hub of the of like outdoor recreation. Right, like you can you take your RV out and you bring your other outdoor recreation accessories with you, like your bikes in the back or your or your kayak or whatever it is, and so it is a really good entry point to customers.
Speaker 2:But eventually we want to have other product lines that are not just RVs, you know, but but the towable will be kind of an all electric aerodynamic. You know, if you have an EV truck and you want, or even SUV, and you want to tow the trailer with that, it won't hurt your range as much as some of these much bigger, boxier trailers out there. And then of course it'll have a big battery so you can even, like, charge up your EV if you get somewhere, and then power. You know it won't have any gas, so it'll just be sort of an all electric version.
Speaker 1:Cool and I saw that if people want to rent one, you've partnered with RV shares that right Just in Detroit only so people can try them out.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So right now, yeah, if you're in Detroit or coming to visit, or coming to visit Michigan, you can rent a G1 from Detroit. We were thinking about, you know, maybe making G2s available, but for rent, the problem right now is we have to. We want to kind of prioritize actual customer orders for G2s, but but that might be something that we do in the future. And then, and then you know too, if you're an owner, you know, if you buy G2, I think there's a good chance that you might want to rent it out to make a little extra money or help pay for those payments when you're not using it. And so that's something that we also definitely encourage and can help connect people, like if we get interest in a certain place to rent one and connect that person with a G2 owner that's in their area.
Speaker 1:Totally. And so these, the G2s, start. Are they just 200,000 or can they go up, depending on what sorts of products and features you add.
Speaker 2:So the way we decided to launch was to keep it as simple as possible. You know, because we're an early stage startup, you can get really complicated with pricing and and super granular, but we just did 195,000, no matter what the options are. So if you get the shower or you don't get the shower doesn't matter. You know for the near future, if you know if you order one now or in the near future, it's just going to be the price will be whatever it is and that's not going to be based on based on any customization. So in the future that will change. In the future we will eventually make the pricing a little bit more sophisticated, so potentially have like a much lower base base cost and then based on what you choose. You know, each thing kind of has its own, each module would have its own price and stuff like that. But we just wanted to start simple and just get something out there and get it into people's hands.
Speaker 1:So yeah, totally. And are you going to be at any like RV shows or van expos in 2024 where people can come see you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're starting to. We're starting to look at that. Right now, we don't have any any concrete plans yet, but we definitely want to bring some vans around the country in 2024.
Speaker 1:Totally cool. Well, thank you so much. Is there anything else you wanted to add that we missed?
Speaker 2:No, I think. Yeah, this was great. Thanks for having me on the show, kristen. It's great meeting you and talking with you about Grounded.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally. I'm looking forward to seeing you know how the camper vans do and I look forward to seeing them out and about as I'm out camping. So good luck with everything and thank you so much.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Thanks Kristen.
Speaker 1:I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Wayward Home podcast. If you know someone who would like this episode, do me a favor and forward it to them. Word of mouth is one of the best ways you can help me grow this podcast. Again, thanks for listening to the Wayward Home podcast and I'll see you next time.